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| Contact = http://www.mywikibiz.com/index.php?title=Directory_talk:Kaiser_Permanente_Customer_Class&action=edit

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| Title = A place for potential Kaiser Permanente Customer Class members can discuss rationales and pros and cons of a class action lawsuit

| Title = A place for potential Kaiser Permanente Customer Class members can discuss rationales and pros and cons of a class action lawsuit (started by IRDT/IReceivedDeathThreats)

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=Flagrant coverage and billing fraud=

=Flagrant coverage and billing fraud=

Have you noticed that Kaiser Permanente flagrantly disregards its own policies to the detriment of patients?  I have.  I am a customer (I.e. Health Plan "member") in an HSA (Health Savings Account) plan.  I've noticed that their plan policies and sales documentation bear little relationship to the actual bills it sends out, prices it charges and coverage decisions it makes.   

Have you noticed that Kaiser Permanente flagrantly disregards its own policies to the detriment of patients?  IRDT has.  IRDT is a customer (I.e. Health Plan "member") in an HSA (Health Savings Account) plan.  IRDT noticed that Kaiser plan policies and sales documentation bear little relationship to the actual bills it sends out, prices it charges and coverage decisions it makes.   

==Examples==

==Examples==

===Annual Physicals===

===Annual Physicals===

I go annually for an annual physical, which is supposed to be free, per the plan policies<ref>See links in [[#Secret cost information]]. </ref>

IRDT goes annually for an annual physical, which is supposed to be free, per the plan policies<ref>See links in [[#Secret cost information]]. </ref>

The first time, they insisted on a copayment of around $75 when I arrived for the appointment.

The first time, they insisted on a copayment of around $75 when IRDT arrived for the appointment.

The second time, they did not, but sent me a bill for around $200.

The second time, they did not, but sent him a bill for around $200.

===STD / VD Testing===

===STD / VD Testing===

I go annually for STD testing, which is supposed to be free, per the plan policies<ref>See links in [[#Secret cost information]]. </ref>.  They billed me around $150 for the tests.

IRDT goes annually for STD testing, which is supposed to be free, per the plan policies<ref>See links in [[#Secret cost information]]. </ref>.  They billed IRDT around $150 for the tests.

===STD / VD Testing===

===STD / VD Testing===

I went for a hearing test, which is supposed to be free, per the plan policies<ref>See links in [[#Secret cost information]]. </ref>.  They set me a bill for a around two hundred dollars.

IRDT went for a hearing test, which is supposed to be free, per the plan policies<ref>See links in [[#Secret cost information]]. </ref>.  They set IRDT a bill for a around two hundred dollars.

==Secret cost information==

==Secret cost information==

I tried to find out how much things would cost, ahead of time.  I wanted to get  

IRDT tried to find out how much things would cost, ahead of time.  IRDT wanted to get information on how much it would cost to see a doctor for a brief follow-up about a growth, and he called and was told there would be no charge.  He arrived for the appointment and they insisted on a copayment of around $75 when IRDT arrived.

I was told that they did not have any kind of price list by two employees.  They both said the information was in their computers, and they could not print it out, or otherwise provide access to it (e.g. via email, download, kp.org, etc.) or answer questions about what was in it.  Then I found just such information online (a sampling of the common ones, that is, but certainly a huge improvement over having nothing!), here: http://members.kaiserpermanente.org/kpweb/pdf/cal/ncal_fees.pdf  (There are similar documents for customers in other areas available online; google "Kaiser Permanente Northern California Sample Fee List", but with your area instead of NorCal.)

 

I've asked if i can get a copy of my plan contract (the so-called Evidence of Coverage booklet) online, but they tell me they don't put it online.   

IRDT was told that they did not have any kind of price list by two employees.  They both said the information was in their computers, and they could not print it out, or otherwise provide access to it (e.g. via email, download, kp.org, etc.) or answer questions about what was in it.  Then IRDT found just such information online (a sampling of the common ones, that is, but certainly a huge improvement over having nothing!), here: http://members.kaiserpermanente.org/kpweb/pdf/cal/ncal_fees.pdf  (There are similar documents for customers in other areas available online; google "Kaiser Permanente Northern California Sample Fee List", but with your area instead of NorCal.)

IRDT has asked if he can get a copy of his plan contract (the so-called Evidence of Coverage booklet) online, but they tell him they don't put it online.   

(Some quotes:   

(Some quotes:   

*"The following preventive care is exempt from the Deductible:  

*"The following preventive care is exempt from the Deductible:  

*"No charge": "Routine preventative hearing tests" )

*"No charge": "Routine preventative hearing tests" )

I've found copies online in the past.

IRDT found copies online in the past.

At least there's this: http://www.fortierinsurance.com/pdf/Kaiser%20Plan%20$0.1500%20Description%20of%20Benefits.pdf.

At least there's this: http://www.fortierinsurance.com/pdf/Kaiser%20Plan%20$0.1500%20Description%20of%20Benefits.pdf.

(Some quotes:   

(Some quotes:   

=Poor Dispute Policies=

=Poor Dispute Policies=

I've disputed many of these fraudulent bills and charges.  I've received 0 apologies.  I've receive 0 thanks for pointing out the errors.  Most of the time, the charges are dropped, but often they aren't - e.g. the STD charges were reduced to around $50.   

IRDT has disputed many of these fraudulent bills and charges.  IRDT received 0 apologies.  IRDT received 0 thanks for pointing out the errors.  In IRDT's experience, most of the time, the charges are dropped, but often they aren't - e.g. the STD charges were reduced to around $50.   

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