In many cases, one finds that both groups are written with the same sign of operation, typically "<math>\cdot</math>", "+", "*", or simple concatenation, but they remain in general distinct whether considered as operations or as relations, no matter what signs of operation are used. In such a setting, our chiasmatic theme may run a bit like these two variants: | In many cases, one finds that both groups are written with the same sign of operation, typically "<math>\cdot</math>", "+", "*", or simple concatenation, but they remain in general distinct whether considered as operations or as relations, no matter what signs of operation are used. In such a setting, our chiasmatic theme may run a bit like these two variants: |