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User talk:Peter Z./Wikipedia & Political Agendas (view source)
Revision as of 16:39, 13 January 2010
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Is Wikipedia taking on a darker tone? Where are the ethical and moral issues involved in creating articles with old communist propaganda rhetoric. This part of Wikipedia is not encyclopedic work, pure and simple.
Is Wikipedia taking on a darker tone? Where are the ethical and moral issues involved in creating articles with old communist propaganda rhetoric. This part of Wikipedia is not encyclopaedic work, pure and simple.
[http://www.mywikibiz.com/Directory:The_Wikipedia_Point_of_View#History The Wikipedia Point of View-History]
[http://www.mywikibiz.com/Directory:The_Wikipedia_Point_of_View#History The Wikipedia Point of View-History]
<!-- MyWikiBiz users, note... Text that appears between these brackets are merely remarks. -->
<!-- MyWikiBiz users, note... Text that appears between these brackets are merely remarks. -->
== Research on Wikipedia’s Communist Propaganda Articles (former Yugoslavia) ==
== Research on Wikipedia’s Communist Propaganda Articles (former Yugoslavia) ==
'''The Balkan World According to Wikipedia''':
'''The Balkan World According to Wikipedia''':
According to Wikipedia if a Commander happens to lose 100 000 POWs after WW2, it is not that important. Sixty years latter it was established that they were murdered and place in old mine shafts, caves and forrests. The information is not to be mention in his biography as it is irrelevant.
According to Wikipedia if a Commander happens to lose 100 000 POWs after WW2, it is not that important. Sixty years latter it was established that they were murdered and place in old mine shafts, caves and forests. The information is not to be mention in his biography as it is irrelevant.
On the 23th of April in 1948, in a speech '''Harry Truman''' (the President of USA) stated:
On the 23rd of April in 1948, in a speech '''Harry Truman''' (the President of USA) stated:
''"I am told that Tito murdered more than 400 000 of the opposition in Yugoslavia before he got himself established there as a dictator"''
''"I am told that Tito murdered more than 400 000 of the opposition in Yugoslavia before he got himself established there as a dictator"''
Reference from: Keeping Tito Afloat by Lorraine M. Lees <ref>[http://books.google.com/books?id=-Xkv7ym8hDYC&printsec=frontcover&dq=Keeping+Tito+Afloat:+The+United+States,+Yugoslavia,+and+the+Cold+War&client=safari&cd=1#v=snippet&q=%20tito%20trade%20papers%20four%20hundred%20thousand&f=false Keeping Tito Afloat Keeping Tito Afloat] by Lorraine M. Lees</ref> & Woodrow Wilson and Harry Truman: Mission and Power in American Foreign Policy by Anne R. Pierce <ref>[http://books.google.com/books?id=cgPc0rsBxSAC&pg=PA219&dq=josip+broz+Tito++harry+truman&cd=5#v=onepage&q=josip%20broz%20Tito%20%20harry%20truman&f=false Woodrow Wilson and Harry Truman: Mission and Power in American Foreign Policy] by Anne R. Pierce</ref> ''(declassified documents from the 1990s)''
Reference from: Keeping Tito Afloat by Lorraine M. Lees <ref>[http://books.google.com/books?id=-Xkv7ym8hDYC&printsec=frontcover&dq=Keeping+Tito+Afloat:+The+United+States,+Yugoslavia,+and+the+Cold+War&client=safari&cd=1#v=snippet&q=%20tito%20trade%20papers%20four%20hundred%20thousand&f=false Keeping Tito Afloat] by Lorraine M. Lees</ref> & Woodrow Wilson and Harry Truman: Mission and Power in American Foreign Policy by Anne R. Pierce <ref>[http://books.google.com/books?id=cgPc0rsBxSAC&pg=PA219&dq=josip+broz+Tito++harry+truman&cd=5#v=onepage&q=josip%20broz%20Tito%20%20harry%20truman&f=false Woodrow Wilson and Harry Truman: Mission and Power in American Foreign Policy] by Anne R. Pierce</ref> ''(declassified documents from the 1990s)''
*Lorraine M. Lees is an associate professor of history at Old Dominion University in Virginia, USA.
*Lorraine M. Lees is an associate professor of history at Old Dominion University in Virginia, USA.
The below referenced information is from 'Government Leaders, Military Rulers and Political Activists: An Encyclopaedia of People Who Changed the World (Lives & Legacies Series)’ by David W. Del Testa.
The below referenced information is from 'Government Leaders, Military Rulers and Political Activists: An Encyclopaedia of People Who Changed the World (Lives & Legacies Series)’ by David W. Del Testa.
''Yugoslavia under Tito was a curious combination of relative economic and cultural freedom and total political repression and control. The lack of political freedom made debate on the role of ethnic identity in Yugoslavia impossible. Tito’s regime had created temporary stability in a historically unstable region. Treated almost as a mythic hero in his lifetime, Tito’s image began to decay in the years following his death, undermining the legitimacy of the regime so connected to his cult of personality.'''
''Yugoslavia under Tito was a curious combination of relative economic and cultural freedom and total political repression and control. The lack of political freedom made debate on the role of ethnic identity in Yugoslavia impossible. Tito’s regime had created temporary stability in a historically unstable region. Treated almost as a mythic hero in his lifetime, Tito’s image began to decay in the years following his death, undermining the legitimacy of the regime so connected to his cult of personality.''' <ref>[http://books.google.com/books?id=vSwi2TYabS4C&pg=PR1&dq=Government+Leaders,+Military+Rulers+and+Political+Activists:+An+Encyclopaedia+of+People+Who+Changed+the+World+(Lives+%26+Legacies+Series)’+by+David+W.+Del+Testa.&client=safari&cd=1#v=snippet&q=%20tito%20leader%20of%20yugoslavia&f=false Government Leaders, Military Rulers and Political Activists: An Encyclopaedia of People Who Changed the World (Lives & Legacies Series)] By David W. Del Testa, Florence Lemoine, John Strickland/ page181 Legacy</ref>
David W. Del Testa’s statement succinctly sums up Josip Broz and his political life. One could say it is well balanced in the objective sense.
David W. Del Testa’s statement succinctly sums up Josip Broz and his political life. One could say it is well balanced in the objective sense.
== Ivo Goldstein ==
== Ivo Goldstein ==
*'''Ivo Goldstein''': 'Croatia A History', a Mc Gill Queen’s University Press Publication.
*'''Ivo Goldstein''': <ref>Croatia A History-Mc Gill Queen’s University Press Publication by Ivo Goldstein. </ref>
:''“Self -management as system was only slightly more efficient than the Soviet model. It was bureaucratised and cumbersome and could not compete with Western economies. People could obtain so much free or for less than the market price (e.g. apartments) that they could be obtain without work. All this made the settling of accounts in the 1980s and in the post-socialist age more difficult.”''
:''“Self-management as system was only slightly more efficient than the Soviet model. It was bureaucratised and cumbersome and could not compete with Western economies. People could obtain so much free or for less than the market price (e.g. apartments) that they could be obtain without work. All this made the settling of accounts in the 1980s and in the post-socialist age more difficult.”''
:''“In Tito’s system no interest or ideas could be expressed in a truly democratic way. This did most harm where feelings of ethnic identity were concerned because their suppression led to growth of extreme nationalism. Furthermore, the economic failure of Tito’s system, most clearly expressed in the protracted crisis of the 1980s, left people who even if they were not poor, were disillusioned and open to manipulation by demagogues. Finally Tito’s practical solutions ensured that he would retain unlimited power during his life time, but foreshadowed the problems would come after his death.”
:''“In Tito’s system no interest or ideas could be expressed in a truly democratic way. This did most harm where feelings of ethnic identity were concerned because their suppression led to growth of extreme nationalism. Furthermore, the economic failure of Tito’s system, most clearly expressed in the protracted crisis of the 1980s, left people who even if they were not poor, were disillusioned and open to manipulation by demagogues. Finally Tito’s practical solutions ensured that he would retain unlimited power during his life time, but foreshadowed the problems would come after his death.”
:The articles clearly state:
:The articles clearly state:
:1. Josip Broz Tito’s failure in adressing ethnic tensions of the former Yugoslavia;
:1. Josip Broz Tito’s failure in addressing ethnic tensions of the former Yugoslavia;
:2. Failure in the economic management of the former of Yugoslavia;
:2. Failure in the economic management of the former of Yugoslavia;
'''Note''': Ivo Goldstein is a Professor at the University of Zagreb
'''Note''': Ivo Goldstein is a Professor at the [http://www.unizg.hr/homepage/ University of Zagreb].
The university is the oldest (1669) and biggest in South-Eastern Europe. The university has 29 faculties, three art academies and the Centre for Croatian Studies. With its comprehensive programmes and over 50,000 full-time undergraduate and postgraduate students. The University is the strongest teaching institution in Croatia. It offers a wide range of academic degree courses leading to Bachelor's, Master's and Doctoral degrees in the following fields: Arts, Biomedicine, Biotechnology, Engineering, Humanities, Natural and Social Sciences.
== Commission on Concealed Mass Graves in Slovenia-Republic of Slovenia ==
== Commission on Concealed Mass Graves in Slovenia-Republic of Slovenia ==
* Cult of a great leader, who permits his fanatics to murder, steal and lie;
* Cult of a great leader, who permits his fanatics to murder, steal and lie;
* Dictatorship of one party;
* Dictatorship of one party;
* Militarization of society, police state – almighty secret political police;
* Militarisation of society, police state – almighty secret political police;
* Collectivism, subjection of the citizen to the totalitarian state;
* Collectivism, subjection of the citizen to the totalitarian state;
* State terrorism with systematic abuses of basic human rights;
* State terrorism with systematic abuses of basic human rights;
Ref: Joze Dezman CRIMES COMMITTED BY
Ref: Joze Dezman CRIMES COMMITTED BY
TOTALITARIAN REGIMES page 197 Slovenian Presidency of the-EU 2008 [http://www.mp.gov.si/fileadmin/mp.gov.si/pageuploads/2005/PDF/publikacije/Crimes_committed_by_Totalitarian_Regimes.pdf]
TOTALITARIAN REGIMES <ref>CRIMES COMMITTED BY TOTALITARIAN REGIMES Crimes and other gross and large scale human rights violations committed during the reign of totalitarian regimes in Europe: cross- national survey of crimes committed and of their remembrance, recognition, redress, and reconciliation Reports and proceedings of the 8 April European public hearing on “Crimes committed by totalitarian regimes”, organised by the Slovenian Presidency of the Council of the European Union (January–June 2008) and the '''European Commission'''.</ref> page 197 Slovenian Presidency of the-EU 2008 [http://www.mp.gov.si/fileadmin/mp.gov.si/pageuploads/2005/PDF/publikacije/Crimes_committed_by_Totalitarian_Regimes.pdf European Commission]
'''Mass killings without court trials''':
'''Mass killings without court trials''':
''The killings without a trial were most massive in the first months after the war in 1945 and continued until the beginning of 1946. How extensive these killings were is illustrated by the fact that 581 hidden graves of victims of post-war killings without a court trial have thus far been found in the territory of Slovenia.''
''The killings without a trial were most massive in the first months after the war in 1945 and continued until the beginning of 1946. How extensive these killings were is illustrated by the fact that 581 hidden graves of victims of post-war killings without a court trial have thus far been found in the territory of Slovenia.''
Ref: Milko Mikola CRIMES COMMITTED BY TOTALITARIAN REGIMES page 163 Slovenian Presidency of the-EU 2008 [http://www.mp.gov.si/fileadmin/mp.gov.si/pageuploads/2005/PDF/publikacije/Crimes_committed_by_Totalitarian_Regimes.pdf]
Ref: Milko Mikola CRIMES COMMITTED BY TOTALITARIAN REGIMES page 163 Slovenian Presidency of the-EU 2008 [http://www.mp.gov.si/fileadmin/mp.gov.si/pageuploads/2005/PDF/publikacije/Crimes_committed_by_Totalitarian_Regimes.pdf European Commission]
*'''Serbia''' to Uncover Mass Graves-Belgrade 13 August 2009 [http://www.balkaninsight.com/en/main/news/21609/]
*'''Serbia''' to Uncover Mass Graves-Belgrade 13 August 2009 [http://www.balkaninsight.com/en/main/news/21609/]
''The Serbian Justice Ministry has announced that a state commission will be formed by September to mark out uncovered mass graves from 1944-46, daily Danas reported Thursday.The graves are thought to contain victims of Yugoslav leader Josip Broz Tito's Partisans.''
''The Serbian Justice Ministry has announced that a state commission will be formed by September to mark out uncovered mass graves from 1944-46, daily Danas reported Thursday. The graves are thought to contain victims of Yugoslav leader Josip Broz Tito's Partisans.''
*Croatian Law: The first online newspaper of the party in Croatia [http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=hr&u=http://www.hsp1861.hr/vijesti2009-4/30042009-1.html&ei=Lo5NS6isMsqHkQXiqtygDQ&sa=X&oi=translate&ct=result&resnum=2&ved=0CAwQ7gEwATgU&prev=/search%3Fq%3DTitoism%2Band%2BTotalitarianism%26hl%3Den%26client%3Dsafari%26rls%3Den-us%26sa%3DN%26start%3D20 -Recognition Regime Victims of the Totalitarian Communism, Fascism and Nazism in Europe!]
*Croatian Law: The first online newspaper of the party in Croatia [http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=hr&u=http://www.hsp1861.hr/vijesti2009-4/30042009-1.html&ei=Lo5NS6isMsqHkQXiqtygDQ&sa=X&oi=translate&ct=result&resnum=2&ved=0CAwQ7gEwATgU&prev=/search%3Fq%3DTitoism%2Band%2BTotalitarianism%26hl%3Den%26client%3Dsafari%26rls%3Den-us%26sa%3DN%26start%3D20 -Recognition Regime Victims of the Totalitarian Communism, Fascism and Nazism in Europe!]
== Mr Dizdar's ''Scientific Journal'' Study Notes==
== Mr Dizdar's ''Scientific Journal'' Study Notes==
*''Item A''-An Addition to the Research of the Problem of Bleiburg & Way of the Cross
*''Item A''-An Addition to the Research of the Problem of Bleiburg & Way of the Cross <ref>[http://hrcak.srce.hr/index.php?show=clanak&id_clanak_jezik=27516&lang=en Hrcak Portal of Scientific Journals of Croatia] by Mr Dizdar's ''Scientific Journal'' - An Addition to the Research of the Problem of Bleiburg & Way of the Cross. This paper dedicated to the 60th anniversary of these tragic events represents a small step towards the elaboration of known data and brings a list of yet unknown and unpublished original documents, mostly belonging to the '''Yugoslavian Military''' and Political Government 1945-1947. Amongst those documents are those mostly relating to Croatian territory although a majority of concentration camps and execution sites were outside of Croatia, in other parts of Yugoslavia. The author hopes that the readers will receive a complete picture about events related to Bleiburg and the Way of The Cross and the suffering of numerous Croats, which is confirmed directly in many documents and is related to the execution of a person or a whole group of people and sometimes non-stop for days.</ref>
'''Translated:''' Josip Broz Tito, the supreme commander of the NOV and PO-Yugoslavia and President of the National Committee of Liberation of Yugoslavia, sent on 30 August. 1944:
'''Translated:''' Josip Broz Tito, the supreme commander of the NOV and PO-Yugoslavia and President of the National Committee of Liberation of Yugoslavia, sent on 30 August. 1944:
Other Genocide & Ethnic Cleansing:
Other Genocide & Ethnic Cleansing:
*Hungains & Italians [http://books.google.com/books?hl=en&lr=lang_en&id=RWZLZaxPUXQC&oi=fnd&pg=PA8&ots=xdn2wNxBWP&sig=WN_VKCu5q6lVUOsSoxHdPJGiB-w#v=snippet&q=killed&f=false]
*Hungarians & Italians [http://books.google.com/books?hl=en&lr=lang_en&id=RWZLZaxPUXQC&oi=fnd&pg=PA8&ots=xdn2wNxBWP&sig=WN_VKCu5q6lVUOsSoxHdPJGiB-w#v=snippet&q=killed&f=false]
''Ref'' from: Communist Retaliation and Persecution on Yugoslav Territory During and After WWII by Dr. phil. Michael Portmann
''Ref'' from: Communist Retaliation and Persecution on Yugoslav Territory During and After WWII <ref>[http://books.google.com/books?hl=en&lr=lang_en&id=RWZLZaxPUXQC&oi=fnd&pg=PA8&ots=xdn2wNxBWP&sig=WN_VKCu5q6lVUOsSoxHdPJGiB-w#v=snippet&q=killed&f=false Communist Retaliation and Persecution on Yugoslav Territory During and After WWII] by Dr. Ph. Michael Portmann-The following article deals with repressive measures undertaken by communist-dominated Partisan forces during and especially after WWII in order to take revenge on former enemies, to punish collaborators, and “people’s enemies“ and to decimate and eliminate the potential of opponents to a new, socialist Yugoslavia. The text represents a summary of a master thesis referring to the above-mentioned topic written and accepted at '''Vienna University''' in 2002</ref>. by Dr. phil. Michael Portmann
== Notes on References ==
== Notes on References ==
'''Contemporary views''' of Josip Broz that are clealy referenced:
'''Contemporary views''' of Josip Broz that are clealy referenced:
*'''BBC'''.UK/History Partisans: War in the Balkans 1941 - 1945 By Dr Stephen A Hart
*'''BBC'''.UK/History Partisans: War in the Balkans 1941 - 1945 <ref>[http://www.bbc.co.uk/history/worldwars/wwtwo/partisan_fighters_01.shtml#six BBC-History Partisans: War in the Balkans 1941-1945] </ref> By Dr Stephen A Hart
The article is written in the post ''Berlin Wall'' world. The Wiki article '''does not''' have the [[BBC]] as it's '''source'''.
The article is written in the post ''Berlin Wall'' world. The Wiki article '''does not''' have the [[BBC]] as it's '''source'''.
This encyclopaedic articles clearly state the dark truth about Tito and his Army-[http://www.bbc.co.uk/history/worldwars/wwtwo/partisan_fighters_01.shtml#six Partisans: War in the Balkans 1941-1945]
This encyclopaedic articles clearly state the dark truth about Tito and his Army-[http://www.bbc.co.uk/history/worldwars/wwtwo/partisan_fighters_01.shtml#six Partisans: War in the Balkans 1941-1945]
*'''Encyclopaedia Britannica'''-The article is written post ''Berlin Wall'' but it's thin in terms of information, but does not hold back on economic realities: ''"At his death, the state treasury was '''empty.'''"''
*'''Encyclopaedia Britannica''' <ref>Encyclopædia Britannica: History & Society-Josip Broz Tito</ref> -The article is written post ''Berlin Wall'' but it's thin in terms of information, but does not hold back on economic realities: ''"At his death, the state treasury was '''empty.'''"''
The Wiki article has Encyclopaedia Britannica under its ''Notes'' section as it's source, it might be just cosmetic.
The Wiki article has Encyclopaedia Britannica under its ''Notes'' section as it's source, it might be just cosmetic.
*'''BBC''' UK/History by Tim Judah: ''"The economy was built on the shaky foundations of massive western loans."'' The article is also written in the post '''Berlin Wall''' world. The Wiki article '''does not''' have the [[BBC]] as it's '''source'''.
*'''BBC''' UK/History <ref>[http://www.bbc.co.uk/history/worldwars/wwone/yugoslavia_03.shtml BBC UK/History] by Tim Judah</ref> by Tim Judah: ''"The economy was built on the shaky foundations of massive western loans."'' The article is also written in the post '''Berlin Wall''' world. The Wiki article '''does not''' have the [[BBC]] as it's '''source'''.
*'''Tim Judah''' is a front line reporter for The Economist and author. A graduate of the London School of Economics and of the Fletcher School of Law and Diplomacy at Tufts University he worked for the BBC before becoming the Balkans correspondent for The Times and The Economist. Judah is also the author of the prizewinning The Serbs: History, Myth and the Destruction of Yugoslavia, published in 1997 by Yale University Press.
*'''Tim Judah''' is a front line reporter for The Economist and author. A graduate of the London School of Economics and of the Fletcher School of Law and Diplomacy at Tufts University he worked for the BBC before becoming the Balkans correspondent for The Times and The Economist. Judah is also the author of the prize-winning The Serbs: History, Myth and the Destruction of Yugoslavia, published in 1997 by Yale University Press.
== User:Debona.michel==
== Debona.michel==
"Basically, we are dealing with a small group of mostly young, very aggressive, (extreme) nationalist/jingoist/chauvinist, passionate (24/7), degree-less students who have decided that Wikipedia is their domain/soap box and a no one should get in their way." (8 January 2010)
"Basically, we are dealing with a small group of mostly young, very aggressive, (extreme) nationalist/jingoist/chauvinist, passionate (24/7), degree-less students who have decided that Wikipedia is their domain/soap box and a no one should get in their way." (8 January 2010)
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